Vindende generellse spreadsheets baseret på Pokertracker.

Hej forum!
Første indlæg fra min hånd herinde på siden - i kan dog roligt regne med at se flere.

Jeg har overvejet, om det er muligt at lave faste spreadsheets, der angiver hvad man skal gøre i givne situationer. Det lyder måske en smule BOT-agtigt, men egentlig er det mere en tanke om man kan udnytte statistikkerne fra vindende spillere til selv at blive en vindende spiller.

Tanken går på den feature der kan findes på Pokertracker, hvori man kan se, hvad winning players stats ligger indenfor. Baseret på forholdsvis simple sammenligninger og udregninger kan man da vurdere hvilke hænder de spiller hvordan?

Jeg ved godt, at der ikke findes nogen optimal strategi der gælder i alle situationer, da det er mere effektivt at handle på den givne spillertype og dennes spillestil.

Men tror i, at det kunne være muligt?

Egentlig var det bare en tanke, så kom endelig med feedback på idéen.

/Fagerberg

Velkommen til. :)

Jeg er personligt ikke helt sikker på jeg forstår dit spørgsmål, kan du komme med et eksempel på hvad du præcist mener?

Jeg tror ikke det er muligt.. Eksempelvis ved du ikke om en spiller med en 3-bet frekvens på 10% gør det med en polariseret range eller simpelthen bare top 10% af hans range.. Så at lave et standardiseret handlingsmønster alene fra stats bliver svært og for kompleks.. Jeg spiller dog ikke mere, så måske jeg er off her..

Der er stor forskel på Tour/sng og cash så til en start må vi vide hvad du spiller ... det er dog altid en mulighed at prøve at kopiere vindendes spilleres ranges og spillestil ....hvis det er det du mener

Du kan godt skræddersy din strategi ud fra populations tendenser, men det er ret avanceret, og man bliver nødt til at skelne mellem de forskellige spilletyper for at exploite det maksimalt. Lidt simplificeret kan man sætte det sådan op - Hvis du har 50% fisk i din playerpool og 50% regs, hvoraf regsne cbetter 40%(average) og fiskene 80%(average), så giver det ikke så meget mening at tilpasse din strategi til en 60% overall cbet frq. Det kan bedre betale sig at identificere hvem fiskene er og justere til deres 80% cbet og samme princip med regsne.

Som andre skriver kan du dog aldrig komme til at spille helt perfekt mod villains medmindre du kender deres ranges ned til mindste detalje.

Man skal dog være temmelig skrap til PT4 og filtre for at kunne finde frem til de rigtige pop. frekvenser.

Jeg har en sparringspartner, der har arbejdet med strategier mod populationssegmenter i SNG. Jeg er imidlertid noget skeptisk over for konceptet af et par årsager, og ville foretrække at have godt kendskab til hhv. Nash- og ICM-baseret push/fold samt nogenlunde basic forståelse for 15bb+ play og postflop strategi. Drop spreadsheetet imo, eller lav det for at lægge det i skuffen og quizze dig selv på nogle ranges, du ved fungerer i givne spots.

Fantastisk at man på så kort tid kan få så mange svar herinde! Tak for gode inputs og gode idéer til løsninger allerede.
Jeg havde også lidt på fornemmelsen, at det ville være en stor mundfuld - men som sagt var det også bare en idé!

Jeg spillet Full Ring Cash games NLHE.

For at forsimple min idé lidt, så er den baseret på de statistikker man kan se i PT4 når man udfører en LeakTracker-analyse. Efter man har kørt analysen kan man nemlig se, hvilke values vindende spillere ligger indenfor i de givne stats.

Lad mig give et eksempel:

PFR af vindende spillere i Full Ring NLHE (i lave stakes) ligger mellem 7.6%-14.3%. Dette kan man direkte oversætte til en maksimal range på: 66+, A7s+, K9s+, Q9s+, JTs+, ATo+, KJo+.

Dette er for alle positions - men hvis man nu går ind og tjekker for de forskellige positioner ses det også, at statistikkerne ændrer sig fra position til position.

Tænkte at man måske kunne lave et nemt og overskueligt Excel-ark over disse forskellige ranges.

Herfra ville man måske kunne udlede, at man fra SB raisede med XX, BB med YY, EP med CC osv.?

OBS: Jeg taler ikke hér om at lave en komplet manual til all mulige scenarier på alle streets - men kan man ikke forestille sig, at man ved at arbejde med denne idé kan "optimere" sin range baseret på vindende spillere, hvis man f.eks. spiller mod en ukendt spiller på bordene?

/Fagerberg

For Cash games, har hugget det en gang et sted fra..

VPIP

VPIP stands for percentage of the time that a player voluntarily contributed money to the pot. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 16.5% and 30.1% and for FR, it's between 11.2% and 22.8%. My VPIP is at 16.41% which is considered to be at the lower spectrum of the range. By being borderline low, players might see my bets as very strong and just fold. But when I look deeper in this software, I notice that I'm smack in the middle of the range in the SB, BB and middle position, and below par in the CO and Button, so that's where I need to improve. When I look at my attempt to steal stats, it explains why it's so very low.

PFR

PFR stands for percentage of the time that a player put in any raise preflop. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 12.7% and 20.0% and for FR, it's between 7.6% and 14.3%. My PFR is at 12.67%, again considered to be at the lower spectrum of the range. Same as VPIP, players could think that you've got a strong hand and just fold, BUT it could also mean that the player is slow playing a strong hand, so you'll need good notes on that player to determine the right play. In my case, my VPIP and PFR have the same results, meaning that I'm OK in SB, BB and middle position, and below par in the CO and Button. I need to raise more in late positions.

PFR/VPIP

PFR/VPIP stands for the ratio of how often a player raises preflop to how often he puts money in preflop. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 55.5% and 91.5% and for FR, it's between 49.2% and 86.9%. Basically the lower the number the more passive you are and the higher the number, the more aggressive you are. My overall PFR/VPIP ratio is smack in the middle with 74.86%. My ratio % differs at different positions, for example, in middle position I'm at 92.92%, but in the BB position I'm at 37.61. This kind of says, "sure take my blind". Even though that my overall stat is smack on, when I look deeper into the position, I see a leak in the BB.

3Bet

3Bet is the percentage of the time that a player 3Bet preflop. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 4.2 and 8.9% and for FR, it's between 2.2% and 6.0%. My 3Bet percentage is again, smack in the middle at 6.76% and the good news is that it's for all positions. (between 5.6% and 7.76%). If your numbers are higher, I would consider you a lag player who loves to bluff a lot. Imagine, 6.76% means that I only 3-Bet 7 times out of every 100 hands. How often do you 3-Bet? 3-Bet needs to be used in the right positions against players that you do know (notes).

CBet Flop

CBet Flop % stands for Percentage of the time that a player bet the flop given that he had a chance to do so and he made the last raise preflop. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 59.7% and 83.0% and for FR, it's between 55.4% and 81.9%. My CBet Flop is very low at 49.88%. Continuation bet is important in order to take advantage of weaker players, but facing regular players, you need to know their range, you need to know the player. ** For me, this is a must improve **

Flop AF

Flop AF stands for Flop Aggression Factor, Ratio of the times a player makes an aggressive action (a bet or raise) to the times they call on the flop. For example, a player with an AF of 2 has bet or raised twice as many times as they have called. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 1.7 and 7.4 and for FR, it's between 1.7 and 5.2. My Flop AF is at the low end of the range at 2.42. I just need to make a small adjustment by raising one more time than I call on the flop.

Flop AFq

Flop AFq stands for Flop Aggression Frequency, Percentage of non-checking flop actions that were aggressive. For example, a player with an AFq of 40 made a bet or raise 40% of the time he bet, raised, called, or folded. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 44.5% and 62.4% and for FR, it's between 38.8% and 56.5%. My Flop AFq is almost smack in the middle at 51.69%. For those with lower numbers, you'll need to add bluffs into your flop betting and raising ranges, increase your frequency of bets and raises and use hands with equity like gutters, overcards and backdoor draws.

Fold to F CBet

Fold to F CBet stands for Percentage of the time that a player folds to a flop bet given that the bettor was the last raiser preflop. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 37.9% and 62.5% and for FR, it's between 37.0% and 66.7%. My Fold to CBet is smack in the middle at 50.29%. For those with lower numbers, you'll need to raise connected flops with equity and flat call in order to bluff later on dryer flops.

Fold to F Bet

Fold to F Bet stands for Percentage of the time that a player folds to any flop bet, given that he had a chance to do so. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 51.7% and 65.7% and for FR, it's between 50.0% and 72.4%. My Fold to Flop Bet falls slightly outside of the range at 49.74%. I need to increase the frequency of folding marginal hands. ** For me, this is a must improve **

CBet Turn

CBet Turn % stands for Percentage of the time that a player bet the turn given that he continuation bet the flop. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 36.2% and 64.4% and for FR, it's between 29.7% and 68.6%. My CBet Turn is smack on at 56.80%. Since you just got more information with the flop, CBetting should take in consideration your opponent's range of hands and take advantage of limpers and also be very cautious when betting the turn with no perceived equity.

Turn AF

Turn AF stands for Turn Aggression Factor, Ratio of the times a player makes an aggressive action (a bet or raise) to the times they call on the turn. For example, a player with an AF of 2 has bet or raised twice as many times as they have called. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 1.4 and 4.5 and for FR, it's between 1.3 and 5.1. My Turn AF is at the low end of the range at 1.58. I just need to make a small adjustment by raising one more time than I call on the Turn.

Turn AFq

Turn AFq stands for Flop Aggression Frequency, Percentage of non-checking turn actions that were aggressive. For example, a player with an AFq of 40 made a bet or raise 40% of the time he bet, raised, called, or folded. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 42.2% and 58.2% and for FR, it's between 36.5% and 58.0%. My Turn AFq is also at the low end of the range at 44.96%. For those with lower numbers, you'll need to add bluffs into your turn betting and raising ranges, increase your frequency of bets and raises and use hands with equity like gutters, overcards and backdoor draws.

Fold to T CBet

Fold to T CBet stands for Percentage of the time that a player folded to any open bet on the turn. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 43.9% and 67.0% and for FR, it's between 36.8% and 69.1%. My Fold to T CBet is also at the low end of the range with 50.29%. For those with lower numbers, you'll need fold marginal hands to aggression more frequently and for those that need to decrease their numbers, review if you're seeing the turn to frequently.

River AF

River AF stands for River Aggression Factor, Ratio of the times a player makes an aggressive action (a bet or raise) to the times they call on the river. For example, a player with an AF of 2 has bet or raised twice as many times as they have called. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 1.2 and 3.8 and for FR, it's between 1.0 and 4.6. My River AF is at the low end of the range at 1.45. I just need to make a small adjustment by raising one more time than I call on the River and folding more often.

River AFq

River AFq stands for Flop Aggression Frequency, Percentage of non-checking river actions that were aggressive. For example, a player with an AFq of 40 made a bet or raise 40% of the time he bet, raised, called, or folded. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 36.9% and 56.4% and for FR, it's between 33.0% and 56.7%. My River AFq is also at the low end of the range at 39.46%. For those with lower numbers, you'll need to add bluffs into your river betting and raising ranges, increase your frequency of bets and raises and use hands with equity like gutters, overcards and backdoor draws.

Fold to R CBet

Fold to R CBet stands for Percentage of the time that a player folded to any open bet on the river. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 42.6% and 66.0% and for FR, it's between 35.2% and 70.9%. My Fold to R CBet is smack on with 55.0%. For those with lower numbers, you'll need fold marginal hands to aggression more frequently and for those that need to decrease their numbers, review if you're seeing the river to frequently.

Attempt To Steal - LP

Attempt to steal from - LP % stands for Percentage of the time that a player opened the pot by raising in the cut-off or on the button. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 24.4% and 39.4% and for FR, it's between 15.2% and 39.7%. My Attempt to steal is way to low at 18.53%. I definitely need to increase my stealing abilities.

Fold Blind to Steal

Fold blind to steal % stands for Percentage of the time that a player folded when in a blind and facing an open raise from the cut-off, button, or small blind without any other players being involved. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 75.4% and 91.0% and for FR, it's between 75.0% and 92.2%. My fold blind to steal is smack on at 77.51%, ok maybe a bit more folding.

SB 3Bet Steal Attempt

SB 3Bet Steal Attempt % stands for Percentage of the time that a player 3Bet preflop when in a blind and facing an open raise from the cut-off, button, or small blind. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 4.1% and 13.1% and for FR, it's between 3.1% and 11.8%. My SB 3Bet Steal Attempt % is at the high end of the range at 9.44%. I could decrease my stealing attempt just a little bit.

BB 3Bet Steal Attempt

BB 3Bet Steal Attempt % stands for Percentage of the time that a player 3Bet preflop when in a blind and facing an open raise from the cut-off, button, or small blind. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 3.9% and 14.2% and for FR, it's between 3.1% and 13.5%. My BB 3Bet Steal Attempt % is smack on at 10.34%.

Aggression Factor

Aggression Factor Ratio stands for Ratio of the times a player makes a postflop aggressive action (a bet or raise) to the times they call. For example, a player with an AF of 2 has bet or raised twice as many times as they have called. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 1.8 and 4.6 and for FR, it's between 1.7 and 4.8. My Aggression Factor ratio is at the lower end of the range at 2.1. I could increase my aggression just a little bit by calling less out of position and raising more frequently.

Aggression Freq.

Aggression Frequency % stands for Percentage of non-checking postflop actions that were aggressive. For example, a player with an AFq of 40 made a bet or raise 40% of the time he bet, raised, called, or folded. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 45.2% and 58.4% and for FR, it's between 40.28% and 54.68%. My Aggression Frequency % is in range, but at the low end at 48.56%. Again, I need to raise more frequently while calling and folding less frequently.

WSD

Won Money at Showdown % stands for Percentage of the time that a player won some money at showdown, given that he got to showdown. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 52.2% and 66.5% and for FR, it's between 50.7% and 67.7%. My Won Money at Showdown % is within range but on the low side at 53.62%. I need to call rivers with a tighter range

WTSD

Went to Showdown % stands for Percentage of the time that a player went to showdown, given that he saw the flop. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 21.1% and 32.8% and for FR, it's between 21.7% and 33.8%. My Went to Showdown % is a bit over the maximum range at 33.61%. I need to fold more on earlier streets, call river with a tighter range and value bet more conservatively.

WWSF

Won When Saw Flop % stands for Percentage of the time that a player won some money in some fashion, given that he saw the flop. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 45.5% and 53.2% and for FR, it's between 42.0% and 51.5%. My Won When Saw Flop % is at the low end of the range at 46.91%. I could increase my WWSF by CBetting more frequently.

WSD After River Call

WSD After River Call % stands for Percentage of the time that a player won at showdown given that he called a bet or raise on the river. For low stake 6-max, the average is between 33.6% and 71.1% and for FR, it's between 27.2% and 69.2%. My WSD After River Call % is smack on at 42.91%. I could increase it a bit just by calling with the best hand more frequently.

Tak for de mange statistikker Farre!
Lige præcis sådan nogen jeg godt kunne tænke mig at arbejde med :-)

/Fagerberg